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 Post subject: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 10:06 am 
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Joined: 2012-Sep-19 1:30 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
So, we all know that Rite of Replication is brokenly-good when kicked ... but what are the no-brainer targets for it? All else being equal, what creatures should always be targeted when they hit the field? (i.e., creatures that are always good to target, regardless of what else you or your opponents have in play.)

Here's what I came up with; does anyone have any other great options I missed?

Tier 1: Insta-win (often)
Biovisionary - You win unless your opponents can remove 2 of them before the end of your turn.
Gray Merchant of Asphodel - All other players lose 50 life. You gain that much.
Hagra Diabolist - Split 125 points of life loss in 5 point increments as you choose.
Massacre Wurm - Opponents' creatures get -10/-10. Controllers lose 10-12 life per creature that dies
Purphoros, God of the Forge - All other players take 40 damage.
Scourge of Valkas - Split 125 damage in 5 point increments as you choose.

Tier 2: Massive advantage.
Doomwake Giant - Opponents' creatures get -25/-25.
Kokusho, the Evening Star - All other players lose 20 life. You gain that much.
Malakir Bloodwitch - All other players lose 25 life. You gain that much.
Reaper King - Destroy 20 permanents.
Thoughtrender Lamia- Each opponent discards 25 cards.

Honorable Mentions:
Eidolon of Blossoms / Regal Force - Draw 25 cards.
Halimar Excavator - Mill 125 cards in 5 card increments as you choose.
Ink-Treader Nephilim - I'll take five of everything, thanks. (NOTE: Only if you control the Ink-Treader!)
Kalonian Hydra - If you get to attack, you'll have 5× 128/128 tramplers.
Master of Waves - Get a swarm of 6/5 creatures.
Noxious Ghoul - Non-zombies get -30/-30.
Ondu Cleric - Gain 125 life.
Tuktuk Scrapper - Destroy 25 artifacts. Controllers take 5 damage per artifact destroyed.

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Last edited by Willbender on 2015-Jan-20 11:54 am, edited 8 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 10:47 am 

Joined: 2013-Jan-07 1:45 am
Age: Dragon
I think the ones that target legendaries don't work quite that well... Like, if you get 5 purphoros, 4 of them are dead before the triggers are stacked. Although, I guess I'd like a judge explanation on how that works.

Your targets are pretty insane. I think i've actually targetted:

rune-scarred demon - five DTs ain't bad
drogskol reaver - attacking gives... 50 cards?
sphinx of the steel wind - maybe there's a torpor orb in play, ok? :)

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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 10:53 am 

Joined: 2008-Nov-30 12:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
I'm not saying this is worthy of your list, but honestly I've hit a Mulldrifter AT LEAST 5 or 6 times in my life and I've been pleased as punch every single time.

Biovisionary should be on your list, though.
Titans of the Inferno and Frost variety should outright win you the game 90% of the time too.

EDIT: Precursor Golem, bitch!

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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 10:55 am 
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Joined: 2012-Sep-18 11:41 am
Age: Drake
Location: Under a dead Ohio sky...
Sublime Archangel would be pretty good.
edit: Avenger of Zendikar

mmcgeach wrote:
sphinx of the steel wind - maybe there's a torpor orb in play, ok? :)

I did this in a recent game after getting kicked rite on Solemn countered twice in a row. Turns out no one had a wrath and I won pretty quickly after that.


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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 11:11 am 

Joined: 2013-Aug-20 4:37 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Boston
thaumaturge wrote:
Precursor Golem, bitch!
The first one just gives you a huge pile of tokens (5 golems, 10 tokens from them, and another 10 tokens assuming that the original 2 tokens were around). It'll often get you a pretty decent pile of sad robots incidentally, though. The second kicked Rite on a Precursor is super dirty. I don't remember the math off the top of my head, but 6 kicked rites targeting each golem in play (except the original token you target with that one) will get you an obscene number of tokens.

My personal favorite is Eternal Witness. Five regrowths (one likely getting back the Rite) is usually a huge boost.

mmcgeach wrote:
I think the ones that target legendaries don't work quite that well... Like, if you get 5 purphoros, 4 of them are dead before the triggers are stacked. Although, I guess I'd like a judge explanation on how that works.

Breaking it down here it goes:
Rite begins resolving, putting 5 poo-poo horses into play. They see each other come in and will each trigger 4 times (triggers not stacked yet). Rite finishes resolving and is put in the GY..
State-based actions are checked, multiple legends=dead legends.
SBA's check again, this time it is all clear.
Triggers are stacked.
Active player gets priority.


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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 1:57 pm 
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Joined: 2012-Sep-19 1:30 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
mmcgeach wrote:
I think the ones that target legendaries don't work quite that well... Like, if you get 5 purphoros, 4 of them are dead before the triggers are stacked. Although, I guess I'd like a judge explanation on how that works.
It doesn't matter that 4/5 of them die immediately; they do all enter play, all are creatures when they do (they have enough devotion from each other), and all the triggers will hit the stack regardless of their deaths.

thaumaturge wrote:
Biovisionary should be on your list, though.
Titans of the Inferno and Frost variety should outright win you the game 90% of the time too.
EDIT: Precursor Golem
Adding Biovisionary. The titans don't really win you the game for sure, though; they don't have haste, and even if they did they often won't be able to kill multiple opponents in a single turn. (Kalonian Hydra does the best job I could find if you can get to an attack phase, which is why I put it in the Honorable Mentions.)
As for Precursor Golem, I had that in originally, but realized that unless you recur the Rite, you only end up with a few dozen at most - and this is about using Rite in a vacuum. Without recurring the Rite, there's several better single-target token machines (that aren't totally negated by a single lightning bolt). (Note: If you care to know the numbers, a second Rite would have you end up with 279,936 Precursor Golems and 3,779,142 vanilla Golems.)

The rest of the suggestions given also fail the "vacuum test" - while kicking a Rite on an Avenger of Zendikar is one of my favorite plays, it doesn't win you the game (or even put you significantly ahead) without further land drops from you, and a lack of Wrath effects from your opponents. The idea of this list is what will give you a significant advantage (or outright win) immediately upon resolution of the spell.

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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 3:35 pm 
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Joined: 2011-Jan-16 5:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Toronto, ON
Willbender wrote:
Reaper King - Destroy 20 permanents.

This one is actually destroys 25 permanents. Each copy sees 4 other copies, making 20, and the original sees his 5 reflections for 25.

Honestly, kicked Rite pretty much wins you the game, almost regardless of target. I once won because I kicked Rite targeting Zuran Spellcaster.

Mnemonic Wall / Archaeomancer = get a lot of stuff back, including Rite.
Chancellor of the Forge = a lot of goblins... with haste!
Master of Waves = a lot of huge tokens

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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 5:42 pm 

Joined: 2013-Aug-20 4:37 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Boston
Willbender wrote:
(Note: If you care to know the numbers, a second Rite would have you end up with 279,936 Precursor Golems and 3,779,142 vanilla Golems.)

I think that is for the third rite. Assuming you control the original golem, the first Rite leaves you with 6 Precursors and 22 tokens. The second Rite (targeting a token) gives you 6 Rites*5 copies*6 golems for 180 new Precursors (with 360 new tokens thanks to those), and 6*5*22=660 tokens from Rites.


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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 7:08 pm 
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Joined: 2012-Sep-19 1:30 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Sinis wrote:
Willbender wrote:
Reaper King - Destroy 20 permanents.
This one is actually destroys 25 permanents. Each copy sees 4 other copies, making 20, and the original sees his 5 reflections for 25.
Not if you don't control the original - all my calculations are based on the assumption that someone else controls the originals.

Sinis wrote:
Honestly, kicked Rite pretty much wins you the game, almost regardless of target.
I'm clocking about 50/50 of it even significantly altering the game; over half the time I do get off a kicked Rite, either some other player's board state still leaves them a bigger threat (*cough*Ghave, Guru of Spores*cough*), or someone immediately Wraths.

JJackson wrote:
Willbender wrote:
(Note: If you care to know the numbers, a second Rite would have you end up with 279,936 Precursor Golems and 3,779,142 vanilla Golems.)
I think that is for the third rite. Assuming you control the original golem, the first Rite leaves you with 6 Precursors and 22 tokens. The second Rite (targeting a token) gives you 6 Rites*5 copies*6 golems for 180 new Precursors (with 360 new tokens thanks to those), and 6*5*22=660 tokens from Rites.
Nope. The ability of the Precursor is a trigger, not a replacement, so it actually causes the new golems put in by each trigger to be targets of the copies of Rite on the next trigger's resolution, causing an exponential growth.

Basically: 6 triggers go onto stack. 1st one makes copies targeting each golem in play. Rites and ETBs resolve leading to a bunch more golems in play. 2nd trigger goes off, putting copies of Rite targeting all golems in play including the ones put in by the previous trigger's Rites. 3rd trigger goes off, targeting even more ... etc. etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 9:17 pm 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
On the subject of kicked RoR on Precurser....

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 9:24 pm 

Joined: 2013-Aug-20 4:37 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Boston
Ah yes, I was locking in the Rites copies all at once instead of choosing the new targets on resolution.


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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 10:40 pm 

Joined: 2010-Sep-11 12:19 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Joz's list:

1. Luminate Primordial "You can have all the life in the world. But I'm still going to send your creatures on a very long vacation.

2. Sphinx of Uthuun "And you get to choose your doom! And you get to choose your doom! Everyone gets to choose their doom!"

Which brings me to...

3. Rune-Scarred Demon "This, that, this, this and...give me a few minutes."

4. Woodfall Primus "No, I won't copy the Terastodon, I don't need to blow up everything and give you elephants, I just need to blow up most of it and not give you elephants."

5. Zealous Conscripts "Because I can take all your planeswalkers and there isn't a damned thing you can do about it. Ooh, EMBLEMS!"


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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-13 11:16 pm 
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Joined: 2012-Jun-14 2:24 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Trapped in my own twisted imagination.
Stuffy dolls for EVERYONE in response to an opposing Blasphemous Act (it was made instant by Hypersonic Dragon) has been the coolest RoR play I've ever seen.

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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-14 8:39 am 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
How about targeting a Doubling Season that's been turned into a creature by Opalescence?

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 Post subject: Re: Rite of Replication's greatest targets
AgePosted: 2014-Mar-14 8:59 am 
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Rites targeting Magmatic Force wouldn't lead to victory outright, but 15 damage each upkeep is game over for people pretty quickly (assuming you didn't control the first one).

Sid the Chicken wrote:
How about targeting a Doubling Season that's been turned into a creature by Opalescence?

Rites on Forced Fruition with Opalescence out would be pretty amusing. If you control the first one, then all your opponents have "Whenever you play a spell, draw 42 cards."

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